David:     This Sunday, the pastors at our church begin a five Sunday series about prayer. Sound interesting, Karen?

Karen:     Yeah, it does sound interesting. And if they were to ask one of us for input, can you think of something unique to us that we might share with them?

David:     I can think of a lot of things that would be probably similar to what they’re going to say, but unique to us. I’ll think about it.

Intro:      Welcome to the Before We Go Podcast featuring Dr. David Mains and his wife, noted author, Karen Mains. Here’s David and Karen Mains.

David:     Just a question, Karen. Do you think people in our congregation could come up with 10 different kinds of prayer?

Karen:     10 kinds of prayers. I think probably they could, the people in our congregation.

David:     As I asked the question, I think now, there’s quite a division between some of the longtime Christians and some of the new people who are attending. So, probably some could, and some couldn’t. Can we come up with 10 different kinds of prayer?

Karen:     Let’s try. Let’s see if we can.

David:     Okay, you started out.

Karen:     Well, there’s always requests. I think we’re all familiar with those prayers where you’re saying, “God help me or I’m needing this, or I’d like to give this gift to a child.”

David:     Yeah, lots of times. Thank you prayers are appropriate. Sometimes people don’t say thank you as much as they please, please.

Karen:     Yeah, right.

David:     But that’s another one. Okay?

Karen:     Praise.

David:     I think a praise is paying God a compliment. This is what I like about you, God.

Karen:     Attributing words to God.

David:     That’s probably better said. Okay, confession?

Some of us have to practice that prayer quite frequently. But that’s saying, “Lord, I messed up. I’m sorry. I wasn’t thinking properly, or I did something purposely that I know offends you. Don’t let me do that again. I do want to be forgiven.” There’s a lot more emotion involved in it than just rattling off words.

Karen:     Yeah.

David:     Go ahead.

Karen:     Well, another one would be intercession.

David:     When you use the word, I’m not sure everybody understands what you’re saying.

Karen:     Praying for others. Holding their needs up before God. I think we pray a lot for relatives who are unsafe, asking that God will bring into their lives influences that will turn them toward him. So, intercession I think is a prayer that most of us are familiar with and use.

David:     I would say speaking in tongues, people would want that on the list. They’re interested in that. That’s six so far, I’m counting. Next one.

Karen:     Well fasting is a form of prayer.

David:     Yeah, nonverbal. Or it could be verbal as well.

Karen:     It could be. But I think mostly the idea behind fasting is to refrain from something and say “I am sincere about my prayers to the extent that I will refrain from this.” And generally, people think of eating. Now I have had an eating disorder so I’m underweight. And so, when I fast I try and say “Well what’s the alternative?” And for me that’s just not watching television.

David:     Okay.

Karen:     That’s one way I solve that problem.

David:     There are musical prayers.

Karen:     Good idea. I love that. What are some of the musical prayers that we have?

David:     I’m thinking the fiddler on the roof and tell you say, “Wish I were a rich man.” Because that’s a prayer. “Lord who made the lion in the lab, would it spoil some great eternal plan if I were a wealthy man?” It’s a prayer. Those are all through our lives.

Karen:     But I think a lot of the hymns we sing in church are really…

David:     Yeah. “Lord make me an instrument of peace.” So that’s a prayer.

Karen:     Yeah.  

David:     Just set the music.

Karen:     It would be good for people to just think as they’re singing some of these familiar hymns and choruses if they aren’t really singing prayers. That would be a new thought.

David:     A lot of times so. Sometimes it’s testimonies. Sometimes it’s challenged. But musical prayers are a big part that we don’t think of quite that often. We need two more, okay?

Karen:     Okay. You heard a clip of Billy Graham being interviewed about praying without ceasing.

David:     He was being interviewed on television and I don’t remember who the MC was, but he said, “What is that verse pray without ceasing? What do you mean by that?” And Billy said what?

Karen:     He said, “Well I’m praying without ceasing right now.”

David:     Yeah. Which was neat as dear Billy. What a great guy. Yeah.

You have to come up with one more and I would say that expressing feelings is one. You know, early in the morning you’re up and you’ve set aside time to meet with the Lord. “I am so tired Lord. You’ll have to excuse me because my brain’s not working.”

Karen:     I’m swamped. I have so much to do today and panicky about not getting it done. And I have a wonderful prayer that the Lord has taught me to pray when I feel that way, which has been often. And that’s let the day be the day. The Lord is the day keeper, and He will control what is in the day. And I just respond to them not worry about it.

David:     There’s something that you mentioned there. There are these prayers that I’ve prayed every so often. “Lord, I’m at the end of my rope. I can’t figure this thing out. I’m turning it over to you and I’m not even going to think about it again. It’s in your hands. I’m just leaving it alone because I don’t know where to go with it.” They’re kind of an exasperation prayer. There are prayers in the scriptures where they’re very mad at enemies. Lord, do terrible things to…

Karen:     Oh yeah, cursing prayers. Those are… those are…

David:     Okay, we got started on this anyway. Let’s stop and I’m going to go do another. Five good prayers in scripture. Can you come up with people who are good prayers? Not counting Jesus.

Karen:     Well, the prophets were so intimately entwined with God being his messengers and having his hands upon them. And I think much of what they even say in the books that are named after them are prayers.

David:     Well, the whole book after Jeremiah is the lamenting book or Lamentations. And that’s Jeremiah just weeping because of the defeat of his country in Jerusalem, the capital city. That’s a name of a person, Jeremiah. I think even after that Daniel’s one, I think of all the time, saying you can’t pray to anybody but the big guy. And I’m thinking of him getting caught because he almost defiantly, “I can’t pray to anybody but the king. I’ll open the windows and I’ll pray, and you can watch and listen to me if you want.”

Karen:     Right, he did.

David:     I’m going to do it anyway. A woman? You think of a woman in scripture who’s a great prayer warrior?

Karen:     You have the story of the older woman, Anna, in the temple waiting for the revealing of the Christ, I think is what the scripture says. about her, but she just spent her life in prayer in the temple.

David:     Yeah, I’m thinking about Esther as well.

Karen:     Esther?

David:     In the Old Testament, it rallies the whole nation to pray and fast. There’s that word again.

Karen:     Before she goes before the king.

David:     We didn’t mention the apostle Paul, all of his letters. Never cease to pray for you, remembering our enjoyment and the spread of the gospel together and so on. Moses in the Old Testament, the people saying, you go talk to him.

Karen:     Go up on mount. Go up on that mountain bed where there’s fire and, yeah.

David:     Okay, we got ourselves pretty well started on the topic. But would there be anything we could contribute that might not be said by the pastors of the church? And I put it into a sentence.

We talked about this ahead of time. A pen and paper plus a place to write can greatly enhance one’s prayer life. A pen and paper plus a place to write can greatly enhance one’s prayer life. Want to start talking about that?

Karen:     Yeah. This is the most significant I have done in my life. As far as developing what I would say is a life of prayer now. I mean, my turn 80 this month. So, this doesn’t come early in our lives. It’s a matter of practicing. But I pray with a pen, and I have eight and a half by 11 journals that I have recorded my prayers in for 40 years. I’ve started to go back through them because I find it to be a very powerful record of my life as it was lived, but more than that, God’s work in my life. I have kept all my prayer journals for 40 years. And I do that partly because it’s a reminder to me of God’s work in my life, a record of where we were in our lives and our married life together.

And let me explain just what my formula is. So, I always put the date down. It’s very frustrating when I go back into my prayer journals, and I haven’t put the date down because then I don’t know exactly when I was praying these prayers. And I try and find one phrase after I put the date in that is a phrase of praise. “I praise you, well, let’s just say because you are the day keeper. You’re the one who plans my days out in ways I can’t possibly understand or foresee. I just trust that you are doing it. That means that I have to go with your flow, the flow of how the Holy Spirit or God is working in my life.” So, I put that praise down and then I might write some scripture out. If I have scripture that I have been reading at this time, but often I read my scripture at another time and then I do my prayer time when I can fit it in better. The next thing is I just write out a whole list of things I’m thankful for. So, I have 40 years of prayers of thanksgiving that I can go back and it’s a reminder to me of how God has worked in my and our lives daily. I mean it’s very powerful when you go back over that remember.

David:     And how many times do you do this in a notebook per week, say?

Karen:     I try and do it every day, but I probably get five days in. So, then there’s that whole list of thank you’s. And after I’ve done the thank you’s, then I have my list of requests. You know, these are the things I’m praying about. These are the areas where I need help. This is where I need wisdom. I don’t know what to do. I’m trusting that you will give me inspiration or ideas, or I’ll read something in scripture that will be my guidance.

It’s a very simple formula, but it has stood me well for 40 years. And so, then when I go back and checks, like I’m doing some writing now and going back through some of the years, I was very sick in 2018. And so, I’m going back over those years and just remembering how sick I was and how hard it was for the doctors to identify what was wrong. I lost 43 pounds between May and September of one year.

So, all of a sudden that comes back to me. But what really comes back to me is how faithful God was and all of that. How he used that time in my life to teach me things about himself and myself that I needed to learn. And I actually used those months to read the literature that was coming out about racism that had not been written before. So, it was a time that was set aside, I believe, by the Lord to sensitize me to those issues that are in our culture. So anyway, it was very profitable time even though we couldn’t figure out what was wrong.

David:     That’s now to a large degree you’ve been resolved. Just a couple of questions that come to mind as you’re talking. Do you write your God Hunt sightings in that notebook?

Karen:     Oh, thank you for reminding me. Yes, I do. And we’ve talked about this before, the four categories. I won’t go into those today. It’s how we define a God Hunt sighting. “I’ve seen God work in my life. Here he is. This is what he’s done. Yeah, I do write those down too.” So, thanks for reading.

David:     Anything that I’ve missed that is characteristic of?

Karen:     Well, areas what were you need forgiveness? I’ll write those out too. I don’t hide those. I’ve sinned. I’ve erred. I’ve been judgmental. I come before you. I confess and I ask you to forgive me for that. So that’s also a part of my prayer journal.

David:     I also use a pen and paper when I pray, and I like to pray at my desk. The reason I do that is because it’s almost a surety, once you start to pray, the phone’s going to ring. It’s just like it. If you’re praying at five in the morning, it might not. But there’s always the person who calls and there’s nothing wrong with them. It’s just that it interrupts your time of prayer.

And I find when I’m writing a prayer out and I don’t mean like a story, I’m just writing notes to myself and trying to put it into words in a proper way. “God, this is what I’m feeling or what I want.” I can take the phone call and go right back to it. Whereas if I were just keeping those things in my mind, it’s much more easy to track where my thinking process is going. I also find that I really work hard to say, “Okay, God, here’s what I want or here’s what I’m feeling.” I don’t try to write a finished manuscript. I’m making notes. A lot of times I’m saying, because I’m so used to it, here in a sentence is what I’m going to write. But it helps me to actually see it and feel myself writing that out. Okay, I don’t keep my prayer. I don’t know why. I just don’t think about it that much. So, I don’t date them either. I just write it out and then I fold up the paper and toss it into the waste basket. But the pen and paper really helps me in terms of focus. I’m going to go back to the key sentence.

A pen and paper plus a place to write can greatly enhance once prayer life.

Okay, now, is there anywhere I can show that’s consistent with what scripture teaches? We haven’t mentioned him yet. He’s one of the great prayers of scripture. David.

Karen:     He wrote out all his songs.

David:     These are prayers. He has to write them with something because they have been preserved. I look at it and I think that’s a really good sentence and I can say it is a biblical sentence and I can give a wonderful, wonderful illustration of a man who all his life practiced writing out prayers. Now, not every Psalm is a prayer, but a great number of them are.

Yeah, that gives me such satisfaction because I thought the people who are really biblical in their mind and they don’t like coming in with topics that aren’t biblical, I’m ready.

Karen:     When you say you have to have a pencil and a pad of paper, it is a way to enhance your prayer journal.

David:     Yeah, and for a lot of people who say I’m not literary, I’m not a writer, you’ll find the whole history of the Christian church. There are all kinds of prayers of people who have recorded them.

Karen:     Down through the centuries.

David:     Down through the centuries.

Karen:     We wouldn’t have them as a record in our lives.

David:     Many of the great hymns in the faith.

“When morning gilds the sky, my heart awakening cries, may Jesus Christ be praised.”

You know, there are all these wonderful, strong illustrations of people who have put pen to paper and have made that a part of their prayer life. And I’m sure they prayed spontaneously. I’m sure they prayed in group. There’s another one group prayer, probably one of the great improvements in my prayer life these last four or five years has been being a part of a prayer group. So, it’s a huge topic. And I’m looking forward to what the pastoral team at the church where we’re a part of what they’re going to say. If they ask and other suggestions, I’m ready to.

Karen:     So, some of our American standard songs, “My country, Tis of the great land of liberty of thee I sing” is really a hymn about God being with us in this land.

I think sometimes we need to just listen to the words that have become so familiar to us and realize that they’re really prayers of praise or prayers of petition.

David:     Which one? The Irving Berlin of that part of America. God bless America.

Karen:     “God bless America. Land that I love. Stand beside her and guide her in the night with the light from above. From the mountain to the prairies to the oceans white with foam. God bless America my home sweet home.”

David:     I mean it’s a strong Christian statement. It’s kind of fun. It’s kind of fun and it expands your own understanding of the huge topic being taken up here. Yeah, and I think that’s a great prayer for now if at any time.

God bless this land. Forgive her for many sins. Help her through the hatred that is there. The rancor let us learn to love one another and together to love you.

It’s wonderful. It’s great if while you’re singing that you’re also feeling the words and understanding that you’re praying. That’s a great day to move forward too and maybe that day will come back again sometime. But if it does one of the reasons undoubtedly people will say is because we have become proficient in our prayers and we’re just kind of exploring the whole topic.

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